Military planes dropped “radiation bombs” by U.S. cities — 60 times more radioactivity than released during TMI meltdown

Subj: Military planes dropped "radiation bombs" by U.S. cities - 60 times more radioactivity than released during TMI [Three Mile Island] meltdown

Military planes dropped “radiation bombs” by U.S. cities — 60 times more radioactivity than released during TMI meltdown

Military planes dropped “radiation bombs” by U.S. cities — 60 times more radioactivity than released during TMI meltdown

Title: Humans Used for Radiation Experiments: A Shameful Chapter in US History

See also: Victims of suspected radiological spraying in St. Louis suffer thyroid, other cancers -- Helicopters covered children in powder -- "Oh my God, if they did that there's no telling what else they're hiding"

Humans Used for Radiation Experiments: A Shameful Chapter in US History

Details

Written by John LaForge

03 May 2013

EXPOSE REVISITED - This year marks the 20th anniversary of the declassification of top-secret studies, the “Human Radiation Experiments,” done over a period of 30 years, in which the US conducted radiation experiments on as many as 20,000 vulnerable US citizens.

Victims included civilians, prison inmates, federal workers, hospital patients, pregnant women, infants, developmentally disabled children and military personnel — most of them powerless, poor, sick, elderly or terminally ill. Eileen Welsome’s 1999 exposé The Plutonium Files: America’s Secret Medical Experiments in the Cold War details “the unspeakable scientific trials that reduced thousands of men, women, and even children to nameless specimens.”
The program employed industry and academic scientists who used their hapless patients or wards to see the immediate and short-term effects of radioactive contamination — with everything from plutonium to radioactive arsenic. The human subjects were mostly poisoned without their knowledge or consent.
An April 17, 1947 memo by Col OG Haywood of the Army Corps of Engineers, reported by The Washington Post on Dec. 16, 1994, explained why the studies were classified: “It is desired that no document be released which refers to experiments with humans and might have adverse effect on public opinion or result in legal suits.”
In one Vanderbilt University study, 829 pregnant women were unknowingly fed radioactive iron. In another, 188 children were given radioactive iron-laced lemonade. Detailed by a 1986 report of the Subcommittee on Energy Conservation and Power, from 1963 to 1971, 67 inmates in Oregon and 64 prisoners in Washington had their testicles targeted with X-rays to see what doses made them sterile.
At the Fernald State School, mentally retarded boys were fed radioactive iron and calcium but consent forms sent to parents didn’t mention radiation. A 1994 Minneapolis StarTribune report, “48 more human radiation experiments revealed,” noted psychiatric patients and infants were injected with radioactive iodine.
In a rare public condemnation, Clinton Administration Energy Sec. Hazel O’Leary confessed to being aghast at the conduct of the scientists. She told Newsweek in 1994: “I said, ‘Who were these people and why did this happen?’ The only thing I could think of was Nazi Germany.” None of the victims were provided follow-on medical care.
Scientists knew from the beginning of the 20th century that radiation could cause genetic and cell damage, cell death, radiation sickness and even death. A Presidential Advisory Committee on Human Radiation Experiments was established in 1993 to investigate charges of unethical or criminal action by the experimenters. Its findings were published by Oxford University Press in 1996 as The Human Radiation Experiments.
The abuse of X-radiation “therapy” was also conducted throughout the ’40s and ’50s. Everything from ringworm to tonsillitis was “treated” with X-radiation because the long-term risks were unknown or considered tolerable. Joseph Mangano’s 2012 Mad Science: The Nuclear Power Experiment reveals that children were routinely exposed to alarmingly high doses of radiation from devices like “fluoroscopes” to measure foot size in shoe stores. Nasal radium capsules inserted in nostrils, used to attack hearing loss, are now thought to be the cause of cancers, thyroid and dental problems, immune dysfunction and more, although a National Cancer Institute fact sheet claims there is no clear link between nasal radium exposure and cancer.
In large-scale experiments as late as 1985, the Energy Department deliberately produced reactor meltdowns that spewed radiation across Idaho and beyond. The Washington Post reported the meltdown July 10, 1985, quoting an Energy Department spokesman as saying, “It appears that the test was a complete success.” The Air Force conducted at least eight deliberate meltdowns in the Utah desert in 1959, dispersing 14 times the radiation released by the partial meltdown of Three Mile Island in Pennsylvania in 1979, an Associated Press reported in 1994.
The military even dumped radiation from planes and spread it across wide areas around and downwind of Oak Ridge, Tenn., Los Alamos, NM, and Dugway, Utah. This “systematic radiation warfare program,” conducted between 1944 and 1961, was kept secret for decades.
“Radiation bombs” thrown from USAF planes intentionally spread radiation “unknown distances” endangering the young and old alike. One such experiment doused Utah with 60 times more radiation than escaped the Three Mile Island accident, according to Sen. John Glenn, D-Ohio, who released a report on the program 20 years ago.
The Pentagon’s aboveground nuclear bomb tests of 1945-1962, totaling more than 200, and the atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, are not officially listed as radiation experiments. Yet between 250,000 and 500,000 US military personnel were contaminated during their compulsory participation in the bomb tests and the post-war occupation of Japan.
Documents uncovered by the Advisory Committee show that the military knew there were serious radioactive fallout risks from its Nevada Test Site bomb blasts. The generals decided not to use a safer site in Florida, where fallout would have blown out to sea. “The officials determined it was probably not safe, but went ahead anyway,” Pat Fitzgerald, a scientist on the committee staff, told The New York Times March 15, 1995.
In addition, Dr. Gioacchino Failla, a Columbia University scientist who worked for the Atomic Energy Commission, was quoted in the same 1995 report as saying, “We should take some risk… we are faced with a war in which atomic weapons will undoubtedly be used, and we have to have some information about these things.”
With the National Cancer Institute’s 1997 finding that all US citizens in the country at the time of the bomb tests were contaminated with fallout, it’s clear we did face war with atomic weapons — our own.
(John LaForge works for the nuclear watchdog group Nukewatch in Wisconsin, edits its Quarterly newsletter, and writes for PeaceVoice … where this column was first posted.)

A National ID Card for "U".

A National ID Card for "U".

President Obama's bipartisan "Gang of 8" is eager to ram through the statists' National ID card under the guise of "immigration reform." And when the Senate comes back into session on Monday, Harry Reid is expected to move quickly on this dangerous scheme. I can't stress enough how dangerous of a threat a National ID card is to our liberties. So please take a moment to read John Tate's important email below from Tuesday and learn the latest on this battle. In Liberty, Ron PaulChairman Dear Ron, Now that President Obama has his bipartisan Gang of Eight, he believes he has all the tools he needs to RAM through a National ID card under the guise of "immigration reform." This is the worst National ID scheme we've seen yet. And the fight could begin as early as next week! Please read the memo below from Norm Singleton - C4L's Vice President of Policy - explaining exactly what we're facing right now. With the Senate coming back into session next week, time is running out. Please sign your No National ID Petitions IMMEDIATELY. In Liberty, John Tate President Date:   April 29, 2013 To:     John Tate         President From:   Norm Singleton         Vice President of Policy Re:     National ID Card Fight Looming Overview It is often said, "No man's life, liberty, or fortune is safe while our legislature is in session." Next week, the Senate comes back in session after a brief one-week recess, so buckle up. The schemes are coming fast and furious, as Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid is trying to finish up ramming a slew of power grabs through the Senate before Congress' extended August recess. The fights over the National Internet Tax and gun control haven't gone anywhere. But President Obama, Harry Reid, and the bipartisan "Gang of Eight" also want to get their National ID/"Immigration Reform" bill fast-tracked, knowing that time has helped work to defeat these schemes in the past. As soon as the Senate comes back next week, the fight could begin. I am not exaggerating at all when I say this is the absolute WORST National ID scheme we've seen to date. So it's absolutely vital C4L members spring into action to stop this madness NOW. If we're going to win this fight - especially after all the other battles we've taken on in recent weeks - we simply must start raising resources and generating No National ID Petitions IMMEDIATELY. We're not going to have much time. The Gang of Eight's Scheme "Control the borders." "Path to citizenship." "Amnesty." There's no end to the buzzwords being tossed around. And this fight is about to get white hot! But all of the sloganeering is just designed to conceal all the madness contained within this 844-page monstrosity. In fact, the problems are almost too many to list. Besides dramatically increasing federal spending, this bill mandates every American carry a federally issued National ID card with their photo. It also creates a new federal database with biometric information on every American. If passed, the bill would: *** Require a new National ID card based on Social Security cards and a national database containing biometric identification information, such as fingerprints, retinal scans, or scans of veins on the back of hands, which could easily be used for government tracking. *** The card would be required for all U.S. workers regardless of place of birth, making it illegal for anyone to hold a job in the United States who doesn't obtain the ID card; *** All employers would be required to purchase an ID scanner to verify the ID cards by making sure the information on the card matches the information in the federal database. So every time any citizen applies for a job, the government would know. You can bet it's only a matter of time until "ID scans" will be required to travel, attend public events, or make even routine purchases. By far, the most dangerous part is the biometric tracking technology, which would allow federal bureaucrats to track our every move. In fact, it sends shivers down my spine just reading through all the new mandates and requirements. This is exactly the type of battle that often decides whether a country remains free or continues down a slide toward tyranny. Once government bureaucrats know exactly how we live our lives, it won't be long until they try to run them. It will only be a matter of time until they spend their workdays making sure you and I don't go anywhere, read anything, eat anything, or drink anything they think we shouldn't. Knowing many citizens have had massive success derailing National ID schemes at the state level, the statists have come up with a solution . . . Federalize it. In other words, they're getting rid of mandates on state governments to create conforming ID cards. Under this legislation, the federal government would just take on the responsibility of issuing these IDs! The Politics The National ID card is something the establishment of BOTH parties have wanted for years - and they think they finally have the votes to get it done. Reading through the names of the top four leaders of the Gang of Eight is enough to make you feel queasy. John McCain. Lindsey Graham. Chuck Schumer. Dick Durbin. These senators, knowing they have absolutely ZERO street cred with pro-limited government grassroots, have tapped Senator Marco Rubio to deliver their message. Senator Rubio, of course, has presidential ambitions. He's no doubt observed that the last two nominees of the Republican Party - Mitt Romney and John McCain - carved a path to the GOP nomination by consistently stabbing its grassroots' supporters in the back. Their strategy is to flat-out IGNORE the National ID portions of the legislation. Instead, the focus will be on how the GOP was shellacked in the last election and simply "must" join with President Obama to pass this legislation. Just like in the fight over the Second Amendment, the statists don't see the U.S. House as putting up much of a fight against anything the Senate passes. So the Senate may be our best and only chance to take a stand. But this fight will move fast. C4L members MUST start turning the heat up on the U.S. Senate NOW. Proposed Plan of Attack Initially, flooding Senate offices with No National ID Petitions should be our goal. This is to ensure every senator understands that American citizens won't be fooled by their attempts to hide the National ID portion of the so-called "Immigration Reform" bill. The more Petitions we can generate, the better. We should urge every Campaign for Liberty member and supporter to sign a Petition and then immediately begin generating them from other folks, as well. Of course, this will take money, so we'll need a massive influx of funds to accomplish it. With so many battles, our funds are running low. It's absolutely vital we let C4L members and supporters know just how crucial this battle is and urge them to give as generously as they possibly can. Their generosity can help us generate the kind of numbers necessary to win. As you know, back in 1998, then-Congressman Ron Paul was able to spearhead an effort inside Congress to repeal a National ID scheme. I recall how this issue was ignored when Dr. Paul first began talking about it. But then, as grassroots Americans made their voices heard, a flood of representatives joined with Congressman Paul to kill this scheme. Public pressure was key then, and it will be again for this fight. But knowing all of this, Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid isn't likely to wait around. So we have to move fast. As the fight nears, we're going to have to turn up the heat on key Republicans and Democrats who are most likely to go soft. I'm talking to Hill contacts and working on an exhaustive list of Senators now. I will have it to you shortly. But the most important thing now is raising money and generating Petitions for the initial portion of this program. I know C4L members and supporters understand the stakes. We just need to make it clear to them exactly what's going on in Washington, D.C. - and urge them to contribute as generously as possible. Hopefully, C4L supporters will agree to give more than they've done in the past - perhaps even $250 or $100. If they can't give that much, $50, $35 - or even $10 or $20 - will help tremendously. The fight over National ID is absolutely critical. It's not one we can ignore. Without signed No National ID Petitions - and C4L members' generosity - we'll be dead in the water. But this is a fight we CAN win.         Because of Campaign For Liberty's tax-exempt status under IRC Sec. 501(C)(4) and its state and federal legislative activities, contributions are not tax deductible as charitable contributions (IRC § 170) or as business deductions (IRC § 162(e)(1)). http://paracom.paramountcommunication.com/ct/12568456:15482992346:m:1:233134233:ADD3B9CA55FA088F3428C66D78367890:r

BARACK OBAMA AS AN ENLIGHTENED BEING?

BARACK OBAMA AS AN ENLIGHTENED BEING? ~ Cosmic Awareness via Will Berlinghof

Posted By: TwinFlame [Send E-Mail]
Date: Saturday, 4-May-2013 13:47:05

According to the many well-connected sources of Rayelan Allan of Rumor Mill News there are only 2 legitimate channels. One is the Source which spoke through Edgar Cayce. The other is Cosmic Awareness which is being transmitted currently through a gentleman named Will Berlinghof. Cosmic Awareness was asked recently was asked recently whether Barack Obama was a Lightworker. Concerning BO I will politely say CA "ripped him a new one"! http://www.fourwinds10.net/siterun_data/government/obama_government/news.php?q=1367596095 Read Below: May 2, 2013 Will Berlinghof Inter-preter. Joan Mills questioner and energizer. rainbow-phoenix.com QUESTIONER: The first one is from LA. “An update from Awareness is requested regarding Obama's mission as a high level being from the higher dimensions and confirmation that he is in fact such.” Comments please? COSMIC AWARENESS: This Awareness cannot confirm what this individual wishes to be confirmed. There is a note of expectation on the individual's part that President Barack Obama must be a high level spiritual consciousness here to lead the people forward to safety and to take care of the needs of the nation, of the people of the United States of America. There has been much spoken on this not only by this Awareness but other sources that channel information and these sources have often stated that President Barack Obama is a highly evolved spiritual source here to guide the nation forward at this trying time. Unfortunately this Awareness cannot say that this is so in the way that others are presenting it, for It looks rather at the actions of the individual and not simply at the nature of a wish fulfillment by those who would wish him to be this highly evolved spiritual being. His actions of late, and indeed during his whole first term of office, have indicated not a high level spiritual being but one who is in the pocket of those who hold the true power in the world and in your nation. Obama Has Defied the Constitution of The USA His actions have even defied the Constitution of the United States of America itself. He involved the nation in a military action in the country known as Libya without consulting Congress and in this he defied the Constitution. He acted in a dictatorial manner. Even your Supreme Court has ruled that he acted unconstitutionally and that he could be impeached for these actions and other actions that he has carried out. A hallmark of his presidency is that he has evoked executive order more often than any other president in the history of the United States, and that this does not require the sanctioning or approval of the government of the United States, of either the Congress or the Senate. These are more the actions of a dictator rather than an individual elected by the people,for the people. He is known to be a bully amongst members of the Congress and the Senate and there have been actions taken against others, for example Hillary Clinton that evidence this. Many do not respect the man who are themselves Congressmen and women, senators and members of the government, for they know the truth of his presidency more than the people of the United States may, who simply see him on the evening news where he is presented in such a way that it is hopefully complementary, unless of course you are watching Fox news. The Fox news Channel is mainly a Republican organization and they do not see him in a favorable light. Another byproduct of his presidency is the extreme polarization that has occurred through his first presidency and into the second term of office, and this polarization of the nation is getting more and more extreme. Furthermore this individual is also involved in acts of duplicity and deceit against the American people. For many months, even years in his first term of office, he was asked to produce a birth certificate proving that he was born an American citizen on the soils of America in Hawaii. This was not forthcoming for many months, even years, but eventually a birth certificate was produced. This was analyzed by many experts and was declared as fraudulent. Recently before his inauguration as the president, the chief registrar in Hawaii also declared officially that the birth certificate that had been presented was fraudulent and was not issued in Hawaii. Yet this man went on to be inaugurated despite evidence proving that he was not an American citizen, and that he was not born in the territories of the United States of America. This means that his entire first term as president and this present term are fraudulent, for the American Constitution it self states that one needs to be born in America, an American citizen, to become the president. This would also mean that all laws passed by him, executive orders or those that have gone through the Congress and the Senate, even the health bill that went through your legislature, through the highest court of the land, the Supreme Court, even this is a bogus legislation. Are these therefore the actions of a highly evolved, enlightened being? These actions portray the exact opposite. Furthermore, as to the nature of American politics itself –no leader can become the leader of your nation unless they are sanctioned by the power Elite of your country, those who hold true power. Obama is Nestled the Pocket of the Elite The individual Barack Obama was approached many years ago to assume a role that would eventually bring him to power, to the highest office of the President of the United States of America. He was wooed to this and he chose to go this direction. His wife Michelle Obama was also one who has connections through her own law career to those ones in power, and the two together were convinced that this was the best way to go, that they would have the best rewards by being the servants to those in power. This they became. The president himself, before he ever became president, was also seen to partake in the Bilderberger conferences along with Hillary Clinton. The Bilderberger group has long been known to be kingmakers and many leaders around the world, including Tony Blair, the former Prime Minister of the United Kingdom, including Stephen Harper, the present Prime Minister of Canada, were known to have gone to Bilderberger meetings where they were told the plans of putting them in power. The individual Barack Obama was also told that there were plans for him and Hillary Clinton to both become presidents at various stages. The plan originally was to have Hillary Clinton as the first female president and she would then be followed by Barack Obama. But due to political infighting through a schism in the Democratic Party itself, plans altered during the presidential elections of 2008 and instead of Hillary Clinton becoming the first female president of the United States, Barack Obama who was to follow later, was hoisted onto the Democratic Party. Infighting and Backstabbing Amongst the Democrats Much infighting behind the scenes, and back-stabbing did take place. It was a very nasty and vicious power play that eventually saw Barack Obama being the elected leader of the Democratic Party, something that Hillary Clinton would not accept for the longest time, which is why she held on for so long. Indeed her being offered the post of Secretary of State was somewhat of a carrot offered after the fact to bring the ranks together again. But even here there was dissension and tension between Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton and later events in her capacity as foreign secretary can be seen now to indicate the tension that existed there between them. As to Barack Obama being a highly evolved spiritual being that is here to guide the people of the United States, to lead America forward, the evidence does not show this and when one truly looks at the evidence of the actions of the President of the United States one cannot say that they are the actions of an evolved being. The evidence further shows duplicity and deceit, and therefore to wish to have it confirmed, to wish that this Awareness confirms that the president is one who is the evolved soul that others claim him to be is not that which this Awareness can do. This Awareness has always said that there is a potential for this man to rise up but he would have to be of great courage, and would have to stand in the face of those who are the controllers and declare himself. He is aware that when he does so his life may well be forfeit, for they have also shown him that should he ever oppose them, should he ever turn on them, that his family would be murdered. His wife, his children, even the family dog, his mother and others close to him would be murdered and that he too would also be killed as a result of his betrayal. However if he were to stay on board to play the game he would gain tremendously. He would have personal wealth and power, and he would be a figure of prominence in the world and would have fame as well. This proved to be a much more lucrative path for this individual to follow and therefore he has followed a path of self-interest and not a path that is a path of high service to the people of the United States of America. Many of these details are there for individuals to look at and to truly be open to receive if they are willing. Many Would Rather Believe the Fantasy But this Awareness sees that many in the United States would rather believe the fantasy projected at them by other sources than this Awareness—that this is a highly evolved being, even perhaps the reincarnation of President Abraham Lincoln and that he is here to take the Afro-Americans and the poor and the downtrodden back up to where they belong—he is here to lead the nation forward to high spiritually evolved states of consciousness and awareness. Many of those who channel these predictions, these statements of his high spiritual nature and from where it comes and who he may have been, are often those who are under direct manipulation and control by organizations such as the CIA, and this has been put out to appease many, and to make many believe that President Barack Obama is indeed a nice guy, a truly gifted leader with the highest intent for the people of the United States of America. Those who believe this and wish to have it confirmed do not necessarily look at the truth of the situation, or atthe actions of this man. It is because they know that what is needed is a high spiritually evolved being that will take the United States forward, and that this man who is now the president is not showing himself to be such. His actions, as this Awareness has already stated, are proving the opposite. This Awareness has also in the past said that there is a possibility that he could assume such a role if he was ever freed from his political handlers, and if the marionette cords that are used to play him are cut and severed, then there may be a chance that he might finally rise up and take charge and control. But he would also then have to stand in front of the people, admitting the actions he has already carried out and already passed in his executive orders that are against the United States and the people of America. He would have to have the courage to face the backlash of the many who would be disappointed and disillusioned by the truth of his actions, and this may well disqualify him from being an effective leader for the people of America. He may have the potential, but this does not necessarily mean that it will be actualized, but that this Awareness at least can say that there is a potential for greatness in this man, but unfortunately it is not seen by this Awareness that he will step into this greatness. He is more an agent for those dark ones, the cabal that have true power still but who are starting to come apart at the seams. Therefore this Awareness would say to one and all, “Do not look to President Barack Obama to be the Savior.” Even though there might be some potential there, he would have to face his own demons first. He would have to have the courage to stand up and accept the consequences of the actions he has carried out in his terms of office, and it would need to be a man who had a transformational experience that has taken him away from the dark path and put him back on the path of Light, which he is not on at this time. Many will be Angered by the Words of this Awareness This Awareness is aware that many will be very angry at the words of this Awareness, and will be disappointed that this Awareness cannot see the greatness of this man and his truly evolved being. But this Awareness cannot confirm that President Obama is of that highly enlightened status here to lead the people of America forward. It can only say, “Look at the past actions of this man, look at the present actions of this man, look at what he gains by being a puppet to the regime of power, and look at the evidence that is there, especially at this time as he tries to manipulate the American people in gun legislation with orchestrated events such as Sandy Hook that he has much information and knowledge of, and yet stands in front of the television cameras and proclaims the need for the gun registration and control, knowing that if Americans give up their guns they will be even more targets for the foreign powers that are currently in your land, to the plans of the Powers That Be.” If, after this, one would still hold that this individual is of the highest nature with the sacred task of moving the nation forward, of being the Messiah and the shepherd of the American people, leading them to the promised land –that if this is what one still wishes to believe then Awareness simply says,“Please believe what you will!” The evidence suggests otherwise, but one and all are free to believe that Barack Obama, the current president of the United States, is the Savior for the United States. This would put this matter outside of themselves yet again and not put the responsibility on each and every individual to look at the situation clearly, to ask questions, and to demand the truth. Take Responsibility and Be Willing to Look at the Truth It is only once one takes responsibility and is willing to look at the truth of the situation that one can see the truth and then one can be guided in their actions. Look not to the President of the United States to be the leader, but look within yourself to find leadership that lies within, free of the political machinations, free of the sham of politics that is current in your nation. Then you will see that the route to true democracy and true freedom lies not in the hands of another who is deceitful but rather is the responsibility of each and every being in the nation that is the United States of America. When one takes responsibility for their own freedom and will not tolerate the gross injustice that governs your land at this time, then and only then will actions be taken by individuals that will unite them as a true force, the true force of the people, and then the people will finally rise up and demand true democracy, true freedom, and true liberty. This completes this answer at this time. Editor’s Note: March 26th Obama signs Monsanto Protection Act into law while millions of Americans sit before their TV and wonder about Kim Kardashian’s new wardrobe. ----- Original Message ----- From: PARTNER SUPPORTTo:  'Bellringer' Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 10:49 AM Subject: Obama as Enlightened Being? http://www.fourwinds10.net/siterun_data/government/obama_government/news.php?q=1367596095

IMMEDIATE WARNING TO JOINT CHIEFS OF STAFF OF THE PENTAGON FROM ERASMUS OF AMERICA - MAY 4, 2013 1:50 PM

Many games are played in Wash., D.C. and many things are done never admitted by those speaking for Wash., D.C. Rumors have been strong of a planned detonation of nuclear bombs in America on potentially May 5, 2013 and using this as the excuse so Obama can seize military control of America and become dictator of America for life. Having spent eleven calendar years in military academies, having a heavy background in military intelligence, and pulling the upset of being trained like a Soviet general in nuclear tactics to annihilate America with secret tactics of the Moscow Institute For Nuclear Studies by a defector who became best friends with me after he secretly moved to America under an alias background, etc. I know how the Russian military think a lot better than the Pentagon generals in Wash., D.C.

     If seduced elements of the military are cooperating with Obama to try and set off the detonation of nuclear bombs tomorrow for a planned military takeover of America by Obama, better cancel your plans fast. If this is tried, the Russian military will think this is the moment to hit America with everything they have. They have two surprises each intended to annihilate America if you weaken American military defense briefly so they can play their best military cards against you then. When Wash., D.C. was so  busy stealing $525,000 from me in January, 2004 and also engaged in occasional federal murder attempts against me to silence me if they could, it was a little awkward then to think of tipping off the Pentagon what I knew about current Russian military plans to annihilate America at any moment you dropped your military guard a little too much. Putin already warned you before if you try anything to turn America into the base to establish a one world government over all nations, then Putin (and China backed him) warned you that Russia and China will stop you then from being able to do this. This is double-talk translated into English means they say they will annihilate America if you try this. Any detonation of nuclear bombs tomorrow or soon afterwards will likely force them to carry out their military threats to annihilate America then. Got the message, boys at the Pentagon? Way too hot to try this. Also, I grew up with Chinese families and know how the Chinese think. China was not bluffing when they warned they would back up Russia to stop Wash., D.C. from using its tricks to set up a One World Government. Neither country is interested in being governed and conquered by the secret boys who really run Wash., D.C. instead of the American people who are not responsible on important national issues so do not have the foggiest idea what is really going on in Wash., D.C. Russia has already lost much of her prior empire due to C.I.A. tricks, etc. and as a bunch of Russian military swore years ago, when the time is right, they will pay America back for ruining Russia then. 

      Also not smart to try and murder me at this time. The Russian military know that I know their military tactics and know that to save America, I would show the Pentagon the correct way to build the Soviet-era Doomsday Bomb which creates a Mexican standoff where it no longer makes any sense for Russia to pick a nuclear fight with America in that case. So America and Russia would have to learn how to live in peace with each other as both sides would be annihilated if America had the Soviet-era Doomsday Bomb designed to break through all air defenses and wipe out the nation or continent it is aimed at. I am not interested in seeing fools either side suddenly start a nuclear World War III by miscalculation on what the other side would do. If anything happens to me, you would convince the Russian military that you were so colossally dumb to destroy your best ace to block any Russian attempt at annihilating America, that they would judge the military leaders of the Pentagon were dumb morons and so why not annihilate America in that case? Also, the dummies in Wash., D.C. by stealing my $525,000 in January, 2004 and thinking this a funny joke tied my hands so I did not have the money to confirm if Russia still had their old military base set up to annihilate America with or else had moved it to a new location. I am trying to save the American people from having to face a brutal nuclear war in a World War III which would be horrid beyond anything the American people could ever imagine. As for Wash., D.C., I am not sure you are worth saving but for the sake of the American people, I will save your neck from nuclear annihilation if you play ball with me and stop the damn nonsense with me. To start with, return the federally stolen $525,000 to me and call the return anything you want so you don't admit guilt to stealing it from me. Maybe a faint chance I can still get the military technology which will keep America from blowing up as a continent which includes Canada and Mexico too if the Russians accidentally hit the right target by mistake. I had a very difficult source to deal with but had the technology lined up I recognized could save America from potential annihilation. Part of the $525,000 would be used to buy this technology which might save 300 million Americans from suddenly going up in nuclear dust when all of America erupts into colossal explosion. I do not think it smart to discuss this matter further. If you know what I am talking about, fine! If you do not, then don't admit it as the Russian military already think you are dumb as all hell in the Pentagon. And Obama is the biggest joke to the Russian military that they think they have ever faced. They think that he is so dumb in military as to guarantee them victory if war comes. They don't respect him and think it incredible that any national leader could be so dumb in military as Russian intelligence analyzes Obama is.

     I know that Washington intelligence sources as well as many foreign intelligence sources have been watching like hawks every report I have posted with Nesara News since April of 2012. You read all of my reports so I don't have to worry whether you will read this report or not. You will in Wash., D.C.!

     Now average Americans, copy this report and send it all over America and now! If one nuclear bomb hits one correct location in America, then the entire continent of North America may explode very suddenly and everyone dead in North America likely including Canada and Mexico as well. If the explosion goes too far, it may also kill off most of mankind or maybe all of mankind on earth. As much or too much of mankind cares nothing for God, then let's ask the blunt question. Why should God care about people that care nothing for God? I have heard it said, "When you show God that you care, then God will show you that He cares!" The moral corruption in mankind is enormous. Stunning Miracles of God have occurred in Christianity from the time of Christ to 2013 and in all ages many heavily documented. But that does not count to corrupt sources. So many trillions of odds against evolution occurring in the human body exist that makes it impossible for evolution to ever have occurred, but that does not matter. Many prophecies of Christianity over the centuries have occurred exactly as predicted much earlier, but that does not count! The Old Testament in math code appears to have predicted the major events of mankind for maybe around 3,000 years or so, but even though against odds of billions against this being by random chance in a number of these Bible prophecies hidden in math code and math is the universal language of science, this doesn't count to believe that the Bible is supernatural and written by the Spirit of God. Albert Einstein commented that he believed in God as the odds were impossible against the laws of science having occurred by random chance or math. Sir Isaac Newton, "Father of Modern Science," firmly believed in God and the Bible. He spent half his time in bringing science up to our modern age in application and standards, and half his time was spent studying the Bible for a hidden Bible code by math or other means that he believed existed in the Bible. Modern Israeli mathematicians and Christian Bible scholars finally proved that he was scientifically right when they discovered the Bible Code in the Old Testament naming our modern leaders, events, dates, etc. correctly even 2,000 years and more before they actually happened in history. But that does not count to the fools that say, "There is no God." Louis Pasteur and many other brilliant scientific minds firmly believed in God and also delivered stunning discoveries to mankind in science and medicine at the same time, so believing in God does not make a man stupid, just means that he is on one side of an issue others who claim they are scholars are on the opposite side of this issue of the existence of God or not. 

     Spiritual values will likely decide whether America lives or dies as a nation, so it is time to speak up for the truth and not be afraid of not being "political correct" which was a Communist movement started in America when a Communist intellectual fled Nazi Germany in the 'thirties and was financed by wealthy Americans to establish this "politically correct" movement in America. This was intended to try and overthrow the values America was founded upon as a race and nation in 1776. I think the Founding Fathers of America showed a lot of brains in what they said and did back in 1776 and afterwards. They won against impossible odds among other things. Modern lawyers, politicians, and many scholars think they were dumb morons in the principles of law and civilization they believed in back in 1776. I represent the restoration of the Founding Principles of America in 1776 by passage of my Omni Law posted on my website. Most of those who hold in great contempt what America stood for back in 1776 want through Wash., D.C. to overthrow once and for all the founding principles of America in 1776 and replace it with Communism, Islam, or apparently under Obama both systems combined in America to replace the U.S. Constitution and U.S. Bill of Rights as the national law of America.

      My website to see what I am offering America is fastboomamericaneconomy.com  My email is fastboomamericaneconomy.com@gmail.com . Join with me and let's return to the founding principles of America in 1776 rather than the Communist Revolution in America originally suggested by Karl Marx and Lenin. Obama also offers some additional flavor to this by apparently wanting to mix a Communist state with an Islamic state into one national government for America. Read all his moves to try and take away all legal rights of Christianity today and you know where he stands. As Jesus taught, judge a tree by its fruits whether good or bad!

     My postal address which can be used for orders or sending in financial backing is checks, etc. made out to NIFI and sent to NIFI, P.O. Box 1465, Seneca, SC 29679.

And when such as the Pentagon see strong support for me from the American people, this makes it easier for them to be loyal to America rather than to Obama with some pretty wild crazy schemes for America which are not sound nor good for America if carried out.

     Yours For God And Country, Erasmus Of America (pen name for one who loves to study history to know what can work in future history as well. When the fate of a people and nation hang in the balance, some bold, sound leadership at the right moment has often saved a people and nation from pending collapse and destruction they were going to face prior to the leadership which provided them a way to save their race and nation.)     

      

FDR and the U.N.

A friend of mine asked for my opinions on FDR and certain aspects of his conduct as president.

You may be interested in my response, contained in two separate messages.

  

*******************************************************

Second Response:

  

I have not heard back from you. Did you receive the information I sent in response to your request?

I have been thinking further about the FDR thing, and about all the disturbing information I learned in the Chambers and Patton books.

Three things:

1. FDR’s domestic and economic policies were extremely harmful to the nation and to the Constitution. He expanded the role of the federal government far beyond the limits of the Constitution, producing alarming intrusions on civil liberties and unprecedented fiscal burdens which have continued and grown further to this day. Moreover, he unlawfully extended the scope of presidential executive authority by, among other things, issuing an Executive Order which constituted an egregious violation of the civil rights of tens of thousands of U.S. citizens when he ordered the confiscation of the property and the internment in prison camps of entire families of Japanese descent. This is an ugly stain on our nation which was just as horrific as was slavery in an earlier era, and set a precedent regarding presidential executive orders which is being continued today with extremely disturbing implications.

2. FDR’s closest advisor, Harry Hopkins, was later identified as a Soviet agent.

3. The war in Europe should have ended in the summer of 1944 in France. General Patton’s Third Army had three German divisions all but encircled in central France. All that was needed was to close the forty mile wide Falaise Gap, and Patton was on the move. He suddenly received orders from General Eisenhower to halt his advance. Patton was stunned and mystified. If he had succeeded in closing the gap at Falaise, the Germans would have been finished. He pleaded with Eisenhower to reverse the decision, and appealed to General Marshall, who reported directly to FDR.

Patton’s appeal was denied.

Patton seriously considered ignoring his orders and continuing forward to complete the encirclement of the German divisions. Many of his staff officers supported this idea. But Patton was already in disfavor with Eisenhower over earlier accusations of disobeying orders (in situations where Patton had done the right thing despite contrary and ill-advised orders). He was also under intense attack by the leftist press who fed the notion that he was an out-of-control war monger. So he decided reluctantly that he must obey his orders and halt his advance.

This begs the question – why did FDR not want the war to end in 1944?

There are three answers to this question:

1. General Patton was becoming a problem because he was too good, and he knew too much.

2. The British, under the command of the incompetent Field Marshall Montgomery, had been promised a victorious march into Berlin alongside their American allies. The British forces in northern Europe were far behind in achieving the agreed-upon Allied military objectives in their advance toward Berlin, in great part due to serious errors in judgment by Montgomery.

3. Most importantly, the People’s Liberation Army (PLA)   under the command of Marshall Zhukov, was still engaged in desperate fighting hundreds of miles east of Berlin. They too had been promised a share of the spoils in an Allied link-up at Berlin.

So an early victory pulled off by Patton, making him the undisputed and sole victor of the war in Europe, was simply unacceptable.

Conclusion:

FDR, advised by Soviet agents, delayed the conclusion of the war by a full year in order to protect Soviet interests and to protect the Soviet agents in the U.S. government from inevitable exposure by Patton.

Furthermore, if Patton had defeated the Germans at the Falaise Gap, he would have been venerated by the entire world, and it would have been almost impossible to resist his demands to continue on to Moscow and to destroy the Red Army.

Of course, as we all know, Patton was absolutely right, and if his recommendations has been accepted, the separation of eastern Europe from the rest of the continent by an Iron Curtain never would have happened. In fact, the enormously expensive and destructive Cold War never would have happened.

All of this begs a final question, raised by Robert Wilcox in his book about the assassination of General Patton:

Was Franklin D. Roosevelt himself a Soviet agent?

I suggest another larger question:

Did the presidency of Franklin D. Roosevelt serve humanity, or did he set back the quest for the permanent world peace promised by Bahá’u’lláh by decades, if not longer?

You decide.

**********************************************************

First response:

Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 9:47 AM
To: XXXX
Subject: FDR and the U.N.

Interesting question – you may not like my answer.

I have no information that FDR was influenced by the Bahá’í writings.

I do know that one of FDR’s principal advisers at Potsdam and Yalta, as well as at the conferences at Dumbarton Oaks and San Francisco in connection with the formation of the U.N., was Alger Hiss.

Hiss was a Soviet agent. His treason resulted in the abandonment to the Russians of thousands of Allied soldiers in German POW camps in territory taken over by the Russians, as well as the forced repatriation pursuant to Stalin’s demands of hundreds of thousands of refugees and Soviet POWs interned in Allied refugee camps. All of these repatriated refugees and soldiers were executed or sent to Siberia to the Soviet Gulag on their return to Russia in railroad boxcars.

Hiss had delivered secret American and British working papers for the conferences to Stalin, and was aware of the Soviet bugging of the hotel rooms where U.S. and British representatives were staying, completely sabotaging the Allied negotiating strategy at the end of WW II. His role in these conferences resulted in the consignment of millions of innocent people in Eastern Europe to decades of life under the tyranny of Communism behind the Iron Curtain.

But FDR agreed to all of this. No such person could have been influenced by the Bahá’í teachings - at least I hope not.

It is also reported that Alger Hiss was the primary U.S. drafter of the U.N. charter. He was doing so under direction from his Soviet handlers.

The U.N. has been a great disappointment – it is controlled by leftist and third world thugs who hate liberty and freedom. It is has also become a mountain of corruption and a massive waste of U.S. taxpayer funds. This occurred in large part, I believe, as a result of the structural flaws which were intentionally incorporated into the U.N. charter by Alger Hiss and the Soviets. Stalin did not sign on to the U.N. charter because he was naïve – he knew exactly what he was doing.

Hiss was also deeply involved in scheming by the leftist U.S. government to insure that Mao Tse-tung was not defeated by the Nationalist forces in China. This is a long story, but quite shocking. Chang Jung discusses this in her landmark book “Mao: The Untold Story”.

There are numerous books which document these facts, but which the leftist media refuses to report on. Several which I have read recently include the greatest American autobiography ever written – “Witness” by Whittaker Chamber, a former colleague of Alger Hiss in the Communist Party. This is the book which had a profound impact on Ronald Reagan, resulting in his conversion from a Socialist to a conservative. I will forward to you my review of “Witness”.

Roosevelt was directly warned about Hiss by Whittaker Chambers in the late 30s after Chambers ‘deserted’ (as he put it) from the Communist Party. FDR ignored the warning. His entire administration was infested with Communists who were committed to the destruction of the American constitutional republic and the rule of law. Chambers’ description of his experience in the Communist Party and his return to God, and his “Letter To My Children” which served as the foreword to “Witness”, are extremely moving. (See attachment)

Here is a key paragraph from that letter, in  a section labeled

“What does it mean to be a Communist?

A second significant book on this topic is “Target: Patton – The Plot to Assassinate General George S. Patton”  by Robert K. Wilcox. The information disclosed in this book is truly shocking. It appears that the Roosevelt administration and the Soviet NKVD (predecessor of the KGB) colluded in the assassiv>

In nothing shall I be so much a witness, in no way am I so much called upon to fulfill my task, as in trying to make clear to you (and to the world) the true nature of Communism and the source of its power, which was the cause of my ordeal as a man, and remains the historic ordeal of the world in the 20th century.

For in this century, within the next decades, will be decided for generations whether all mankind is to become Communist­, whether the whole world is to become free, or whether, in the struggle, civilization as we know it is to be completely destroyed or completely changed.

It is our fate to live upon that turning point in history.”

A second significant book on this topic is “Target: Patton – The Plot to Assassinate General George S. Patton”  by Robert K. Wilcox. The information disclosed in this book is truly shocking. It appears that the Roosevelt administration and the Soviet NKVD (predecessor of the KGB) colluded in the assassination of General Patton, with the active assistance of the leftist U.S. press, which painted Patton as a loose cannon and possibly insane.

Patton not only recognized the evil of Stalin and the Soviet Union, but he also had intimate knowledge of the many extremely serious errors in judgment and poor leadership by Marshall, Eisenhower, and Montgomery in the conduct of the war. These mistakes resulted in prolonging the war needlessly, and the loss of life of hundreds of thousands of German and Allied soldiers. For one thing – the horrible and brutal winter campaign in the Ardennes Forest in the winter of 1944-45 (“The Battle of the Bulge”) never should have happened.

Patton made no secret of his intention to insure that Eisenhower could never be elected to public office, and of his utter hatred of the evil nature of the Communists and Communism – both Soviet and U.S. (General Patton went out of his way to insult Marshall Zhukov at a celebratory joint Allied dinner at the conclusion of the war, which intelligence sources reported led Stalin to order the Patton assassination.)

This assessment of Communism was shared by General Claire Chennault in China – founder of the Flying Tigers – who was outraged when he learned of a secret U.S. mission to Mao involving a meeting with Chou En-lai in Yenan where the People’s Liberation Army (PLA)  was holed up in northwest China. This meeting was approved by FDR at Hiss’s insistence. Following FDR’s death in April 1945, Chennault let his feelings be known to Truman and consequently was relieved of command of the Fourteenth Air Force in China.

Chennault was one of the greatest generals of WW II and saved millions of Chinese people from savage treatment at the hands of the invading Japanese troops. Yet he was not even invited to the Japanese surrender ceremony in Tokyo Bay.

For these reason and more, I would not want to see the Bahá’í Faith associated with FDR. Furthermore, I can’t believe that he would have done so much to facilitate the spread of Communism in the world if he had been influenced by the Bahá’í Faith.

Sorry – I doubt that you expected this kind of response. I believe FDR caused incalculable damage to this nation, which has much to do with the dire condition in which we find our country today. The truths discovered by Whittaker Chambers are more relevant today than when he wrote “Witness”.

From: XXXX
Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 7:27 AM

Subject: for a friend

A Baha'i friend of mine is writing a book... He is asking a question you both probably know :-)

Here it is:

I have always believed that Roosevelt had pushed for the creation of the United Nations (San Francisco 1945) because he had been inspired by Baha'i books that would have been handy. But is this true?

Could you please find an answer to that question. I would be very grateful.

The Terrorists Have Been Identified

The Terrorists Have Been Identified 

 Posted by Vatic Master

 

Vatic Note:  This is an amazing report.  Corbett is truly a genius when it comes to news analysis through political eyes and the bits and pieces of the story that fits within the intention of the powers that be, to manipulate the sheep into giving up their freedoms, guns, and country.   He is so right when he says "The terrorists have been identified".  

The quesiton he asks is "Who hates us for our freedoms?"  Once you answer that, you answer who the terrorists are.  Well, the current foriegn occupiers of our government TRULY HATE US FOR OUR FREEDOMS since those protected freedoms interfere with their thousands of years old agenda for global domination. 

They have created, through their access to power within our government, the structures, personnel etc that they need to manipulate and cause these terrorist acts.  We have pointed out more than once that key positions within our gov are controlled by these foreign occupiers and they have done a lousy job of hiding their involvement in those terrorist acts.  The media has had to be used to overcome the exposure of DHS involvement, along with private mercs, Seals, and FBI involvement. 

They do it through brainwashing techniques on the boob tube.  They continually spew mantra after mantra as to what we are suppose to "think" out here and eventually you see others commenting and repeating word for word what the media says.  That is how these agencies overcome mess ups on their part.  The press plays a vital role in treasonous acts against the American people and that is on both the left and right.  Those same traitors will be tried before a Nuremberg trial court for crimes against humanity.

I am specifically referring to Homeland SEcurity as one example.   When Hillary was in power, she took the lead as Secretary of State, but now after being caught messing up the Benghazi affair,  the job has been turned over to Homeland security.  They are khazar Zionists tht occupy that dept, and its the Zionist bankers that own the press, so its a perfect match.  One covers for the mistakes of the other.   Watch the video.  Its long, but well worth the effort since its so full of great information and connections to help us see the truth of it all. 

The Terrorists Have Been Identified 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYIPvWeQAtE&feature=player_embedded#!

Published on Apr 19, 2013

SHOW NOTES AND MP3: http://www.corbettreport.com/?p=7301

The specter of terror is once again being raised to haunt the collective consciousness of the American psyche. But as the terror meme rears its ugly head, we see an understanding of false flag terrorism creeping into the mainstream discourse. 

 

Join us this week on The Corbett Report as we explore the real terror paradigm and examine who really hates you for your freedoms.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=bYIPvWeQAtE

The article is reproduced in accordance with Section 107 of title 17 of the Copyright Law of the United States relating to fair-use and is for the purposes of criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, and research

 

http://vaticproject.blogspot.com/2013/05/the-terrorists-have-been-identified.html

The Battle For Real Currency Begins

Arizona Governor Jan Brewer vetoed legislation Thursday that would have made gold and silver legal tender in 2014.

Gov. Jan Brewer (Photo by Jonathan Gibby/Getty Images)

By Avalon 
Intellihub.com 
May 3, 2013

Intellihub.com posted an article titled Gold & Silver is Now the Real Currency in 2012? on August 22, 2012 –

Will 2012 be the year that the American People finally realize the true power of controlling their own currency? It looks like the state of Utah has already taken action. The passage of HB 157 Currency Amendments came about so swiftly that within months, the entire country could be dealing in real tangible assets that Gold and Silver have represented for centuries.

On Thursday, May 2^nd, 2013, after passage in the Senate, Arizona Governor Jan Brewer vetoed legislation that would have made gold and silver legal tender in the state in 2014.

Governor Brewers Official statement reads:

RE: Senate Bill 1439 (legal tender)
Today, I vetoed Senate Bill 1439. This bill would have recognized Specie coin authorized by Congress as legal tender in the state of Arizona. While I believe the concern over a devalued dollar as a result of an unsustainable federal deficit is justified, I am unable to support this legislation. I believe the provisions in this legislation need to be more carefully examined and there should be prior coordination with those government agencies tasked with the oversight of these transactions.
It is important to note that the administrative and fiscal burdens for both the taxpayers and the Department of Revenue remain vague. For example, it is unclear whether this legislation would require Arizona to exempt income tax related to a transaction involving collectable coins or bills that were originally authorized by Congress and may be used as legal tender. This would result in lost revenue to the State, while giving businesses that buy and sell collectable coins or currency originally authorized by Congress an unfair tax advantage.
These concerns are among the primary reasons I have vetoed Senate Bill 1439.

Reuters.com mentions in their article Arizona governor vetoes bill making gold, silver legal tender

The push to establish gold and silver as currency has become increasingly popular in the United States in recent years among some hardline fiscal conservatives, with the backing of groups including the Tea Party movement, American Principles Project and the Gold Standard Institute.
MineWeb.com basically echoes the Reuters article almost word for word. Their previous article on Utah does make a few good points:
Utah Gov. Gary Herbert last week quietly signed a law which has made Utah the first U.S. state to recognize federally issued gold and silver coins as legal tender.
However, the governor chose not to make any public statement about the Utah Legal Tender Act.
Utah’s state tax code now considers U.S. Mint gold and silver coins as currency, which means no capital gains or other state taxes will be levied when the coins are exchanged. However, the gold and silver coins are still only worth their face value despite record gold and silver prices.

Intellihub.com considers these developments in Silver and Gold Currency one of the most important issues today – and we will be reporting on Silver & Gold regularly.Sources:

^ Gold & Silver is Now the Real Currency in 2012?
^ UPDATE 1-Arizona governor vetoes bill making gold, silver legal tender
^ The Gold Standard Institute
^ American Principles Project
^ http://azgovernor.gov/dms/upload/PR_050213_SB1439VetoLtr.pdf
^ http://www.azgovernor.gov/
^ http://www.azcommerce.com/about-us/news/
^ Arizona governor vetoes bill making gold, silver legal tender
^ Arizona Governor vetoes gold and silver legal tender bill
^ Gold, silver coins now officially legal tender in Utah
http://intellihub.com/2013/05/03/battle-for-real-currency-begins/

RUSSIA TODAY: BOSTON BOMBING - WHAT YOU AREN'T TOLD, A VIDEO

RUSSIA TODAY: BOSTON BOMBING - WHAT YOU AREN'T TOLD, A VIDEO

Posted By: IZAKOVIC [Send E-Mail]
Date: Friday, 3-May-2013 12:17:51

The Truthseeker: Boston Bombing - What You Aren't Told (E14) http://www.youtube.com/user/RussiaToday?feature=watch Published on May 3, 2013

Santos Bonacci - "We Are The True Ones.."

Santos Bonacci - "We Are The True Ones.." (6 min vid)

Posted By: Jordon [Send E-Mail]
Date: Saturday, 4-May-2013 11:37:56

. Santos Bonacci At His Best "We are the true ones, we are the sons of God. We are children of light who were produced by light. We will return to the light, we serve the light. We serve truth and we live and die for truth. Never be afraid that you've done something for the truth and that your ridiculed or mocked, or hurt because of it. Because you will always carry that with you in the lives to come, for all eternity. Every little bit that you do for consciousness and to awaken people and to let the truth be known folks will always be counted in this universe, in the Book Of Life." - Santos Bonacci http://youtu.be/BHgbC62kxqg http://www.rumormillnews.com/cgi-bin/forum.cgi?read=275924