God Sends Tornado(s) To District of Criminals, Chops down Babylon's Tree

If you want to find the information previously on the header, it is here, for a couple days while God smashes on Babylon the Great, dividing God's Lambs from Satan's Goats, dividing the nations from each other which were secretly bound together into ONE World Government, called, THE NEW WORLD ORDER of ROME, and thus God is dividing the Wheat from the Tares, because it is HARVEST TIME.

Friday, July 6, 2012


There are times I truly hate being right.


Turner is absolutely wrapped up in this fraud to his eyeballs as in all the others that his cohorts get thrown under the bus for but unless those who know what I know and have been duped by him to participate stand up and sing and insist he be held accountable, I predict he will get away with it once again.


6-24-12 Foreword - LISTEN
BIG WARNING! No EFT success, no followup, hundreds facing foreclosure and court actions, thousands of dollars lost, nothing received in return. (TTS) - LISTEN
DUE DILIGENCE DISCOVERIES - Individual posts disturbing, in-depth research findings into EFT process, FBI warnings, and Fred and Nina Gutierrez. Talks about reducehousepayment.com, mentions Fred's installation of gas mileage-saving hydrolizers in vehicles around the country, Fred's claims he is Clinical Psychologist, etc. Must listen! (TTS) - LISTEN
4-19-12 Talkshoe introduction with Tad Patterson - LISTEN

Fred Gutierrez denies Christian widow $450 refund, accused of not providing services, denies knowledge of "Sandy" and excessive use of her credit card - LISTEN
4-19-12 Christian widow makes her case against Fred and Nina Gutierrez - LISTEN
4-19-12 "Sandy" sets the record straight and tells of abandonment, verbal abuse, credit card abuse, notary fraud, attempted seduction, evasiveness of Fred and Nina Gutierrez - LISTEN

4-19-12 Caller responds to Kelby Smith's attempt to chill First Amendment rights to free speech and prevent victim's from speaking out - LISTEN
4-19-12 Caller warns others, claims in bankruptcy as a result of methods he was taught, claims needy people being hurt, allegations Fred Gutierrez plagiarized methods from others, praises Jack and Margy Flynn - LISTEN

4-19-12 Caller fights for three years to save house and loses it within two weeks of getting involved with Debt Relief Ministry (Note: Now lives in her car) - LISTEN
4-19-12 Caller blames self for being trusting, gave thousands of dollars (his, parent and friend) with expectation of service from attorney's office, receipt for payment refused, verbal abuse, unprepared for unfriendly FBI visit regarding EFT - LISTEN

 4-19-12 Caller praises Jack and Margy Flynn, EFT process looks good at first then reversed, talks about Fred's arrest, people abandoned, materials don't work, alleges no follow through, false promises, many people hurt, Fred gets defensive when challenged, implied threats of physical harm made when refund demanded, eludes to claim Fred former Olympic wrestling qualifier, independent thinkers are enemies, Jack and Margy Flynn used to lend credibility to seminars, leverage US Constitution to "con" people, prays Fred and Nina Gutierrez will repent - LISTEN

 4-19-12 CALLER TELLS ALL! ISSUES WARNING TO FRED GUTIERREZ - Describes meeting Fred and Nina Gutierrez, gave money, talks about likeability of Fred and Nina, mentions Fred as certified Clinical Psychiatrist, describes Fred as "cunning, calculating, strategizing predator, manipulating people's weaknesses", made self guinea pig of Fred and Nina's methods in spite of warnings they were schisters, alleges lack of disclosure, methods flawed, donated thousands of dollars in electronic equipment, plane tickets, etc. Thousands of dollars pre-paid on product orders via credit cards and checks without ever receiving product and/or materials, told chances of receivng product was "zero", alleges "fraud" and "balck magic", accosted by others who did not receive product, talks about despicable use of churches, relationship distressing, people being taken advantage of, lists authorities contacted, encourages victims to submit complaints, happy to have met Jack and Margy Flynn - LISTEN
4-19-12 Same caller testifies dozens of people enrolled in EFT's and none worked and that seminar attendees were used as "guinea pigs", indicates lenders cannot be forced to accept EFT's from an external agent, EFT's don't stick and are reversed, talks about inexperienced people being at a disadvantage in court, lack of full disclosure, inability of Fred to provide substantiation of successes, etc. - LISTEN

4-19-12 Same caller emphasizes problems, talks about disappearance of Fred and Nina Gutierrez, plagiarized materials, felt used and abused - LISTEN
4-19-12 Same caller refers to Fred Gutierrez as psychotic, relays Fred's story of abuse by his father and pressure to perform, challenges others to prove him wrong, still has not received pre-product, claims those who do not bend the knee to Fred are rejected, that Fred beleives he is "king" and above the law, itemizes products not received, but blame placed on customer, mentions people getting arrested, he was abandoned. Adds when Fred Gutierrez feels crossed he get "vicious", and more incriminating assessments - LISTEN

 4-19-12 CALLER TELLS ALL! - Describes firsthand experience with judge ignoring EFT case, gives case number, describes notary fraud on grant deed documentation, indicates potential issues with EFT reversal, paycheck garnishments, her incarceration, FBI visits, Fred and Nina's claim of thousands of hours of research, the inception of the name "setoffdebt" dot com, explains why she separated from Fred Gutierrez because he advised the caller and their family not to appear in court for a seatbelt violation and to flee the country. The caller's refusal sparks feigned assistance from Fred, claims paid for 17 round trip airfares for Fred, refers to being under a "spell", talks about being thrown under the bus for not being subservient, letters don't work, mentions Kelby Smith and Tim Turner, claims Fred admitted no successful EFT process, indicates 2 or 3 EFT's out of 3,000 to 5,000, mentions foreclosures, and more incriminating claims - LISTEN

 4-19-12 CALLER TELLS ALL - GRIPPING - decribes meeting Fred and Nina Gutierrez, engaging in due diligence to research EFT process, then gradually realizing the methods did not work, being faced with foreclosure, holding meetings at their home, talks about arrests beginning to occur, visits from FBI, legitimacy unraveling, abandonment, and going downhill from there. Mentions how Jack and Margy Flynn's materials were most valuable, Fred cautioning followers they are not a "team" and that the keyword to collect money is "donation", EFT reversals after a couple of months and ending up in court, talks about disarming methods used by Fred when presenting, refers to Fred as a psychologist and very manipulating using "black magic" and quoting scripture as a man of God who accepts comparisons of himself to Christ, etc. LISTEN

4-19-12 Jack and Margy Flynn relate how Fred Gutierrez hijacked their methods and experiences and publicly claimed them as his own, characterizing Fred as "sick" - LISTEN
4-19-12 Tad Patterson conference call wrap up with concluding warnings pertaining to Fred and Nina Gutierrez damaging others with final words of encouragement by Jack and Margy Flynn that victims stand up and speak out to prevent others from being harmed - LISTEN
VERY DETAILED - Chastisement to Fred Gutierrez in defense of a friend who did not receive product and services paid for in advance. Allegation of extra-material affair between Fred and an unsuspecting woman who was not his wife, etc. Jack and Margy Flynn praised. Must hear this one for yourself. (TTS) - LISTEN

 Chicago seminar attendee describes not receiving pre-paid product, being left to themselves in dire, time-sensitive matter involving a sherriff's sale of property, getting run-around from Kelby Smith, asserts EFT failure and feels lost, suspicion regarding Fred and Nina Gutierrez, pleas for help, feels disheartened Fred and Nina claim their cause as a ministry and quote the Bible. (TTS) - LISTEN

 Victim characterizes Fred and Nina as "criminals", constitutional challenge presentations made without substantive evidence, recognizes material used by Fred and Nina as plagiarized from Robb Ryder, Bible misquoted and used for "nefarious" purposes, material presented by Fred and Nina is self-contradicting, indicates verifying Fred's claim as being a "licensed psychologist in Seattle, Washington would not be difficult to verify, when discovered that Kelby Smith was facilitating this "fiasco" the "E-Brake" was pulled because they had already been involved with his previous BS to form the Republic of the United States with the Tim Turner scam several years ago. (TTS) - LISTEN

 Internet talk show host Tad Patterson describes slander threat received by Kelby Smith intended to preempt public discussion regarding personal experiences with Fred and Nina Gutierrez, challenges to them to produce substantion as to the success of the EFT methods, and the subsequent "mysterious" interference with 4-12-12 attempt to accomodate victim's calls from Hawaii who were waiting to tell their stories and warn others. Patterson outlines first hand devastation incurred by victims in the form of * Lost Homes * Lost Vehicles * Bank law suits * Garnished Wages * FBI Visits * Arrests * and * Incarcerations. Jack and Margy Flynn are praised. Listen to program and unfolding realization calls have been interfered with by clicking HERE. Also listen to (TTS) - LISTEN

 Victim claims Fred and Nina promised if half of their mortage payment was made to them on a monthly basis for FIVE YEARS the mortgage would be relieved. This individual paid $1,000/month for five months before realizing nothing was being done and they were already six months in arrears. When they attempt to correct the siutation they were already in too deep and being subjected to tactical changes by Fred and Nina and further claim they were promised "templates" to make them mortgage free without receiving follow up. Fred and Nina are blamed for their demise and offer assistance to help stop them from hurting anymore people. (TTS) - LISTEN

Victim warns others through emails Fred and Nina Gutierrez are taking their seminars nationwide potentially exposing others to the "lie". This individual states previous warnings to others were ignored to their demise, other victims were being ignored by Fred and Nina and are desperate for help, individuals are being rallied to take a stand, that Fred and Nina are not providing all the answers, and that many are being summoned into court and are fearful, but fortunately were being provided accurate information (thanks to the victim). Additionally, the victim defends themselves for being truthful in warning others and will tend to them, but mentions they, and JayJay, funded 17 roundtrip tickets and paid for food and lodging for Fred and Nina, adding this was in spite of the income Fred and Nina are  deriving from their "very profitable seminars". (TTS) - LISTEN

Victim warns others and admits they were hoaxed and foolish. Characterizes Fred Gutierrez's court advice as "numbskull", and "totally and completely incompetent" and ridiculing anything he deems as "below the line" as meaningless and not worth his time. Additionally, Fred's "alleged counsel, legal advice and assessment of court proceedings" demonstrate either complete incompetence or deliberate intent to mislead and harm via blatant incompetence. "Very curious behavior from someone who professes to want to help others and take no money for doing so". (TTS) - LISTEN

Victims wants to bring transparency, to Fred and Nina's "unconscionable actions and omissions, which have hurt so many people". The allegation is made of false promises made with no practical help or follow up, under the "guise of donations", followed by unavailability and abandonment. Fred and Nina characterized as "wolves in sheep's clothing". (TTS) - LISTEN

Victim invites others who have pre-paid for product and/or services and have been denied refunds to join them. Contact with authorities in Hawaii and Nevada is alleged followed by specific challenges to Fred and Nina Gutierrez to substantiate the effectiveness and validity of the EFT teaching. A final recommendation is made to others to double-check everything Fred and Nina purport. (TTS) - LISTEN

 VERY GOOD - Another Chicago victim claims, to Jack and Margy Flynn, similar seminar attendee experiences with Fred and Nina as of those in Hawaii. The claims are the Chicago seminar attendees were subjected to excessive stories from Fred, fell victim to the EFT process and were abandoned, left in a "lurch" and out of luck. Additionally, that they had pre-paid for paperwork and were routinely subjected to unreturned calls. The individual claims Fred charged $25/per person, and was provided food and lodging, and further confirms that Fred and Nina have indicated they have plans to move to Costa Rica. (TTS) - LISTEN

An individual passes along information alleging Fred and Nina Gutierrez have abandoned a friend and the friend's mother after promising help and as a result are facing serious charges in California. They go on to indicate they do not want these "scam artists" to harm anymore people. (TTS) - LISTEN

Another victim forwards emails to organizers of a Ventura, California event involving Fred and Nina Gutierrez. Claims disconnect by Nina after a donation was sent in exchange for services involving an IRS matter. Nina became angry when a refund wsa requested claiming donations are not refundable. (TTS) - LISTEN

Individual claims knowledge of several victims who were "sucked in" by Fred and Nina Gutierrez in Hawaii. Additionally, that Fred and Nina perfect their pitch as do carnival barkers, reaping approximately $50,000/mo, and that when Fred was challenged to provided proof of his successes he instead threatened to assault the individual. (TTS) - LISTEN

Individual inquires whether or not email pertaining to Fred and Nina Gutierrez as "frauds" based on an observation of a seminar conducted in Beaumont, California at a church. The seminar was characterized as a traveling medicine show. Jack and Margy Flynn are praised and the subsequent question is posed as to whether or not Fred and Nina are attempting to cause people to get thrown into prison. (TTS) - LISTEN

 3-12-09 A complaint is posted on Rip-Off Report.com pertaining to an unfulfilled order for an Eagle II Dent System purchased from Eagle Marketing. CLICK or (TTS) - LISTEN